Aug 8–10th: Karasawa Cirque, Karasawa-dake, Kamikochi (上高地 涸沢岳 北アルプス)

[Nozomi]

Updates:

We are going on August 8th-10th.

1) Nozomi
2) Asuka-san, can join on 8th-10th
3) Kushal: prefers 14th-16th -> cancelled
4) Tamara
5) Mami, can join on 8th-10th
6)

Summary:
Located in the heart of the Hotaka peaks, in the southern part of the Northern Japanese Alps, the Karasawa Cirque is one of Japan’s great glacial cirques. While some amount of mountain climbing experience is needed to climb the Hotaka peaks, even a beginner can hike as far as Karasawa without much difficulty.

Maximum 6 people can join this trip I am thinking of taking public transportation, but if anyone volunteers to drive, I’d be very happy assist driving. Please bring face mask with you, as we need to take a bus or taxi from Sawando Parking Lot to Kamikochi Bus Terminal, even in case we go by car.

On Day 1, we will be walking approximately 3 hours from Kamikochi bus terminal to Yokoo campground.

On Day 2, we will be walking up to Karasawa Cirque (2,300M) which takes about 3 hours from the campground. If people are ambitious, we can hike through Seitengrad to Karasawa-dake (3,103.3M). Round trip to and from Karasawa-dake will take approximately 6 hours.

If the weather is clear, we can see the panorama of mountain peaks surrounding the Cirque. We will be setting up our tent next to two mountain huts, Karasawa Hutte and Karasawa-goya.

On Day 3, we will be hiking back the same way which should take approximately 5 hours and a half from the Cirque to Kamikochi Bus terminal. The path from Yokoo campground to bus terminal is quite flat, so it should not take too long.

If time allows, we can stop by at one of hot springs/onsen in Kamikochi before heading back to Matsumoto station.

I wanted to visit Karasawa Cirque in late May, but because of state of emergency, it did not realize. Frequency of bus from Sawando Bus Terminal to Kamikochi bus Terminal has recently been reduced to once every hour, so I would assume there are less people than usual in Karasawa.

Event Plan:
Saturday, August 8th:
- 9:50 JR Matsumoto station, at JR line ticket gate, near touring information center
- 10:10 Take Kamikochi Line to Shin-shima-shima Station
- 10:40 Arrive at Shin-shima-shima Station
- 10:55 Take Bus* from Shin-shima-shima Station
- 12:00 Arrive at Kamikochi Bus Terminal, have lunch **
- 13:00 On the trail
- 19:00 Dinner at campground

*Bus Time Table: https://www.alpico.co.jp/traffic/local/ ... himashima/
**Around Kappa Bridge, there are some shops and restaurants.

Sunday, August 9th:
- 7:00 Breakfast at campground
- 8:00 On the trail
- 11:00 Arrive at Karasawa Cirque, Lunch
- 12:00 On the trail
- 18:00 Off the trail
- 19:00 Dinner at campground

Monday, August 10th
- 6:00 Breakfast at campground
- 7:00 On the trail
- 11:00 Lunch on the trail
- 13:00 Arrive at Kamikochi, Onsen
- 15:10 Take bus to Matsumoto
- 15:40 Arrive at Matsumoto
- Around 19:00 Back in Tokyo

Event Grade:
- From Kamikochi to Karasawa is fitness grade – 2, Easy, 6 hours, 795m altitude climb, technical – 2 – Beginner
- From Karasawa Cirque to Karasawa-dake is fitness grade 4 – Difficult, 6 hours, 810m altitude climbing, technical – 4, lower intermediate. There are some chains and ladders. There is one danger sign on the map.

Sign up conditions and contact details:
All members who wish to join must reply to this post.

Things to bring:
- Trekking shoes
- Parka or wind shell
- Fleece / jumper *temperature can be as low as 14 degrees or as high as 23 degrees Celsius in August
- Sun screen & lip balm
- 1L water bottle
- Trail lunch
- Snack for energy
- Dinner for 2 days
- Headlamp w/ batteries
- Onsen towel
- Sleeping bag
- Sleeping pad
- Tent
- Camping stove & gas

Cost
- Train fare (super express Azusa): JPY14,000 round trip
- Bus fare : JPY4,000 round trip
- Campground : JPY1,000 per night
- OCJ fee: JPY500

Car rental normally cost JPY15,000 per day. We need to take a bus from Sawando to Kamikochi, as cars are not permitted beyond Sawando. Bus fare from Sawando to Kamikochi is JPY2,300 round trip.

[Andy OCJ]

I think the route up to the Hotaka lodge is ok for most people of average hiking ability, and to Karasawadake. The views are very good from there.

The other route up to Okuhotaka from the lodge has narrow places and very steep - probably not worth doing that with people you do not know well (if they ask about doing it) - definitely higher grade and a slip would be extremely dangerous.

Karasawa has great scenery just from the campsite though and complete beginners can hike to Karasawa valley if fit enough.

[Asuka]

Nozomi san, thank you for organizing it, this one sounds very nice! I have interested in, but need to check my availability on these days. Until when I should decide??
Asuka

[Kushal]

Hi Nozomi,

I'd be interested in doing it 14th to 16th if possible.

[Nozomi]

Asuka-san & Kushal,

I am happy that you are also interested.
If we have more than 3 people, it makes sense to rent a car. To rent a car, it is better to book a few days in advance. But we need someone who is willing to drive. I got my drivers license in June, so I cannot rent a car on my own. Let's wait and see.

I will check the weather forecast next week and decide if we go on 8th-10th or 14th-16th.

Asuka-san, could you please let me know your availability by noon on Wednesday, August 5th? Thank you.

Nozomi

[Asuka]

Nozomi san, thank you! I’m available on Aug 8-10th, but probably not on Aug 14-16th... so I’d like to join if the weather is good for the first choice.
I hope Kushal can join on Aug 8-10 as well.

[Tamara]

Hi, Nozomi san,
Looking forward to it, I can join any of the dates.

[Mami2020]

Hi Nozomi,

I am interested in this event.
I am available on Aug 8th to 10th.

Mami

[Nozomi]

Hi everyone,
Weather forecast for this weekend seems to be just fine.

https://tenkura.n-kishou.co.jp/tk/kanko ... e=15&ba=kk

@Kushal,
Would it be ok if we go this weekend, 8th-9th. Can you join this weekend. Please let me know.

If we are a group of 5, it maybe slightly cheaper to take public transportation. Please see comparison of total cost to group of 5 below.

Public transportation:
18,000 yen round trip x 5 people: 90,000 yen

Cost of driving car from Shinjuku to Matsumoto:
Highway toll: 7,000 yen x 2 round trip: 14,000 yen
Gas: Maybe 5,000 yen round trip
Car rental: JPY18,000 x 3 days: 54,000 yen
Bus fare from Sawando to Kamikochi: 2,300 yen x 2 round trip x 5 people: 23,000 yen
Total: 96,000 yen

If there are 2 drivers who can take turns to drive, I think we can choose to drive. Main concern is that this weekend is 3-day long holidays and highway may be congested unless we depart from Tokyo very early in the morning on Saturday, for example before 6am.

Please let me know your preference, if any.

In either case, please remember that we still need to practice social distancing and wear a mask when people are around us.

Nozomi

[Kushal]

Hi Nozomi,

I'm sorry, but I will not be able to make it this weekend since I have another trip planned. I hope we can do a trip together next time. Have fun!

Kushal

[Nozomi]

Kushal,

Thank you for letting me know. Enjoy your trip this weekend

[Tamara]

Hi, Nozomi san,
If we take the train, and follow the schedule we must ride the 7 am train in Shinjuku, Chuo line-Limited express @ Azusa ( about 11 stops going to Matsumoto Station arrive around 9:42 am ( 2hrs 42 minutes ) cost 4,070 if reserved seat + 2,550 ( if we take Car until Kamiochi it takes about 4 hrs more or less, and it seems we need more people to share a ride, so I guess train is the best option as of this time. Is it ok if we just jump into the train at 7 am on an unreserved seat, or should we buy tickets at the Shinjuku station for a reserved seat. is the 7 am time is certain., I just rely on my google map info.

[Andy OCJ]

If 30 minutes early you can usualy get unreserved seat - 1 person waiting in queue. Also discount book of 6 tickets you can use to Matsumoto 回数券 if you get before getting on train. I think they can be used for reserved seat but check. They are a bit cheaper than unreserved maybe.

I mentioned to Nozomi, last time we went we left Friday night on express train. Even if crowded there are seats from Enzan or Kofu.
You can take a taxi from Matsumoto or Shinshimashima (might be cheaper from there). Taxi was 500 yen more than bus to Kamikochi and goes to tunnel entrance before Kamikochi. You can walk through the tunnel (use LED light) and camp on the other side in forest on right side. We camped by lakeside and maybe near river possible. Easy short walk Saturday morning to Kamikochi terminal.

It is a more relaxing way to do it.

If 8pm from Shinjuku you can camp around midnight. A train a bit earlier (between 7-8pm better) and you can avoid late night taxi charge.
We got taxi from Shinshimashima (14km,710yen train cost/person) but it is worth calling taxi company in Matsumoto to ask about price from Matsumoto or Shinshimashima station to the tunnel at Nakanouyu.

https://www.google.com/maps/@36.209525, ... 943,17.75z

I prefer this way than rushing Saturday AM.

[Nozomi]

Thank you, Andy. Sounds like a nice plan, but I think that people just want to know what they will be doing on Saturday by now.

Unless everyone wants to leave on Friday night to Matsumoto, let's stick to the original plan and meet at 9:50am at JR Matsumoto station, at JR line ticket gate, near touring information center.

If we have energy on Saturday, we can walk up to Karasawa and camp in great scenery. Andy suggested so. This way, we can spread the hike time evenly over 3 days. Let's see....

The weather forecast is cloudy for this Saturday, Sunday and Monday with only 20-30% chances of rain. It may be windy on Sunday.

https://tenkura.n-kishou.co.jp/tk/kanko ... e=15&ba=kk

Let's pack our back pack and get ready!!!

Nozomi

[Asuka]

Nozomi san, thank you for the update. I’m exited to see everybody on Sat:D
Just wanted to make sure, do we need to bring two breakfast meals as well, or we can get these on the way??

[Tamara]

I like your idea Andy, it will be more exciting to camp late at night, Thank you, but with a short notice I hope to be granted to leave early in my work, my shift finish at 9 pm, so I don't mind to leave early 6 am, just to remind other gals 6:28 @ platform 9-10 leaves the Azusa Express, I was advice to buy tickets earlier., I am not sure of 7 am I will reserve the 6:28 am. So I hope to meet you all in Matsumoto Station.
I like the cloudy weather or little rain, because I feel exhausted if it is too hot sunny day., but I wish we could see the stars at night.
Asuka san, to my calculation, bring 2 breakfast, 2 lunch, 2 dinner. See yah All is well

[Nozomi]

Hi Asuka san

At Kamikochi bus terminal, there are a few shops. They may have bread, cup ramen, etc.

At Karasawa Hyutte, you can also buy similar stuff.

Nozomi

[Asuka]

Nozomi san, Tamara, got it, thank you!

[Tamara]

Wow!! Karasawa Cirque the best mountain  I climb so far in Japan, Thank you Nozomi san for leading the events. Thanks to Asuka san she’s strong and Mami san is too fast she can be a candidate for the trail runner.  It is our Debut in Karasawa Cirque, it has a spectacular 360 views at the campsite, whichever angle you look, you won’t get bored staring at God's work Nature., I wish I could stay more longer, the mountain is positive, has soothing feelings and the weather is cold but fine as long as you got winter clothing. 

We started our trek from the Kappa Bashi, it's nice to watch the surrounding area, blue water, you can bath in the streams for a minute it was really cold, I guess the route from Kappa Bashi, along Dakesawa trailhead through Mt. Mae Hotaka, then panoramic route through Mt. Hotaka, to Hotaka Dake Haute through Karasawa Dake peak, then proceed through Mt. Kita Hodaka before going down to Karasawa Cirque is a more challenging and has a spectacular view on the top of the panoramic route and it needs more than 3 days I guess so. 

Yes, the course we took is a long walk from Kamikochi, Myojin, Tokusawa, i's enjoyable with matching birds, Monkeys around, possible teddy bear too then Yokoo Sanso which we had the first campsite, before proceeding the next day, oh all the campsite has foods and store, so cans, bottle, beer, wine, sake, ramen etc. is available. The course is ok for beginners but the hike going up through Karasawa Cirque is also fine if you have a light backpack going down is so easy. The stream water of Azusa mostly is spring clear water but I really hope the ladies with me are game to soak into the water for at least 30 seconds because there's no source of bathing anywhere in the campsite lots of drinking water though. In the lowland only 2 onsen available, you have to walk for another 20 minutes to reach the hot spring & it’s too crowded. it’s better to bath in the stream along the way uphill or downhill If someone really wants to refresh. I like to bath to connect to the natural water  

The trekking route is natural, non cemented, so its really good natural trail, what I really enjoyed so much are the stones or rocky trail. I feel really Rockin on the top of all rocks, I feel it so much with my barefoot every step of it, so cool, smooth, soft as if I’m walking on the clouds, I want to stay more on the Seitenegrad again with many huge Rock, I lie down on the top of a huge Bed Rock as If I wanted to sleep there forever because of the soothing feeling I cannot feel the coldness but instead I feel warm., You should try it sometimes guys !!  But be careful of falling Rocks you’ll look like a crepe when it hit you and pin down There are many flowers up there ready for you so keep safe when playing around the Rocks, it's either you fight the Rock or Run

I will go back for sure, I enjoyed the Rocks, nature, mountains, trees, flowers, insects, monkeys, birds, snow, rain, sunshine of course the crystal stream and ponds. I Love Karasawa Cirque, it reminds me of Mt. Iglit Thanks to all tough Ladies Debutantes, we had a good vibes I Love Rockin I am Rock!!! Yayyy